FordExcursions.com Forums
ken J
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• Angola, IN, USA |
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• Registered on 8/17/2003 |
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• 9 posts |
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 Posted:9/4/2003 17:46 |
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I am looking at lifting my 00 7.3L Ex. i would like to go with either a 3 inch lift with 33's or a 4-5 inch with 35's. what kit do you recommend, i am debating on either a donahoe edge system, or a procomp system. i would like to have a smooth ride. i am planning on putting a rear sway bar on sometime soon as well. and one other dumb question, i was looking at the front leaf springs the other day, i havent looked at another Ex to see if it is normal, but does the stock leaf spring arch upward??? i only have about 1" between the spring and the bump stop. is this normal???
thank you for your help
Kenneth Jacoby |
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Everett Grabeel
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• Hollister, CA, USA |
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• Registered on 2/7/2003 |
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• 11 posts |
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Posted:9/4/2003 19:29 |
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Yes the springs arc backward, leaves for minimum travel, but a cushier ride for old folks. I used the pro-comp 4" lift on my superduty(same suspension)and the track bar makes a clunking noise on left turns while hitting a dip. The guys at 4-wheel parts said they all do it and offered a different brand track bar mount, I think it was a skyjacker brand. I don't rec. that brand for that reason and I've put on several lifts my self. I live by skyjacker now and use the RS-9000 adjustable shocks, makes for a caddy ride if you want or stiffen it up with the shock adjustments. Another thing is don't go cheap, replace all four springs, blocks just make for axle wrap. Good luck. |
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Marty Smith
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• Tucson, AZ, USA |
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• Registered on 10/16/2002 |
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• 22 posts |
• 1 Vehicle
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Posted:9/5/2003 18:40 |
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What the heck is axle wrap? I thought some of the best lift kits out there ( edge 4.5") use blocks and spring hangers - at least that seems to be the consensus on this forum. Please elaborate. |
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Lou Beckler
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• Wakeman, OH, USA |
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• Registered on 4/27/2003 |
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• 43 posts |
• 1 Vehicle
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Posted:9/6/2003 04:18 |
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When power (torque) is applied to the rear axle the springs twist in a "s" shape as the tires turn aginst the road. This is normal. The softer the leaf pack, the more they twist. If you look at the rear springs on your EX, you'll notice a seperate spring in the pack that sticks forward with a rubber bump stop on it. When power is applied, this bumper snubs up and hits on the spring pack helping to eliminate the spring wrap. As more (or taller) blocks are added between the axle and the spring pack a bigger "lever" is created causing more spring wrap (twist). The stiffer the spring pack, the less twist you get. There are a few traction bars out there that help this also. LANDYOT has a nice fabricated traction/sway type setup on his boat.
MUCK
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MrRottnDog
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• New Lenox, IL, USA |
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• Registered on 2/19/2002 |
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• 103 posts |
• 1 Vehicle
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Posted:9/6/2003 11:07 |
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If your only considering Procomp and Edge. The Edge is far better than the Procomp as the price reflects. Also your going to need 6" to run 35's!
MrRottnDog |
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LANDYOT
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• Subscriber since 11/23/2003 |
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• Newport News, VA, USA |
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• Registered on 7/15/2003 |
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• 1,110 posts |
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Posted:9/7/2003 08:36 |
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Lou Beckler -- Thank you much for the compliment. I've had to turn away a few X-owners who asked about making a set for their lifted rigs, all because I cannot physically take the necessary dimensions off their modified suspension. Now, if they want to make the trek to my place, I'll be happy to oblige.
If you have a stock-height X, and you want to eliminate the spring wrap ... and almost all of the "wandering" ailment ... contact me. The X has the weakest of the Super Duty springs. I recently built a modified set of these radius-rods for an F350 4x4 dually. The F350 has the most stiff leaf springs offered, and yet the owner has written a couple testimonies about how surprised he was at how my rods improved out his (unloaded) ride.
If your intent on lifting, the Pro-Comp traction bars will work nicely. I tend to think the Pro-Comps are geared more for those lifted rigs where the underpinnings are visible for all to see. They look impressive. |
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spartan
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• Nashville, TN, USA |
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• Registered on 7/17/2003 |
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• 86 posts |
• 1 Vehicle
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Posted:9/7/2003 10:52 |
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Here are some excerpts with modifications and clarifications from some of my previous posts that may be of interest to you.
I started with the lift project on my X in early 2000 before a designated kit existed for the truck so I had to improvise a bit. I started with Fabtech 5.5" front springs, complete front box kit, Rauncho shocks and 4" blocks in the rear under the 2" stock blocks. The ride immediately went to crap and driveline problems surfaced.
Then I tried Superlift " Softride " 6" springs front and rear - still a bad ride and more driveshaft issues - mismatched pinion and transmission output angles with insufficient spline contact, etc.. Got the dirveshaft lengthened and worked out the pinion angles, but I still had body boom and the ride was harsh. Real off roading was impossible due to the stifness of the springs.
Then I went back to the Fabtech 5.5" in front and matching 5.5" springs in the rear with all new Fabtech shocks. I put it all together including the 1" blocks Fabtech sends to go in the rear under the stock 2" blocks. Finished up and the truck was sitting like 2.5" high in the rear. Took the rear 1" block out, but the truck still sat high in the rear. The ride was still pathetic and no good for any off roading.
To sum it up, I put alot of money and time into screwing up my X. Handled great like a giant go-cart, but the ride was really harsh. I literally avoided driving as much as possible due to the bad ride. Friends and family avoided riding in the truck as well.
So I figured I'd give it one more try, took off ALL the Fabtech stuff and installed an Edge 4.5" hanger kit with twin Bilsteins up front and singles in the rear. Fresh alignment; rebalanced all four BFG AT 35 X 12.5's. The ride and handling are both oustanding, allthough I'm still in the process of working out some driveline vibration. Remember the lengthened driveshaft which had to be shortened, rebalanced and new shims installed to get my pinion angle(s) right.
FYI - for all applications I have been using 35 X 12.5 BFG AT KO's on 9.75 X 16.5 American Racing wheels.
So for anybody thinking about lifting your X; do you want a show truck or a functional vehicle with a super comfy ride that still handles? I wasted alot of $$$$ to figure this out so maybe by posting this I can save some of you the time and some money - not to mention alot of hard work. I did second and third installs myself because the shops just throw the stuff on without any concern for driveline angles, etc..
Here' some more on the issue from another post after comments were made that I would have been good with the Fabtech or Superlift setup if I had used better shocks to start with.
The replacement springs you get from aftermarket manufacturers are cheap stuff. They are made for one thing - to lift the truck. Take a look at a set and compare them to your stock spring packs - you can immediately tell the difference in quality. No flex and no spring compression rate therefore it doesn't matter what shocks you use it doesn't work. If the springs don't flex - shocks don't do anything.
Are the edge products expensive? Yes, but they are super high quality and there really isn't another option if you want to run 35" tires and keep your comfy C code springs. The 3.5" Fabtech or 3" Edge hanger kit won't get you there on an Excursion. It will on an F250 or F350 because they sit higher in the front to begin with cause of the heavier springs with less negative arch.
In a previous post Mr. Rotten stated that you have to go 6" to run 35" tires. This may be the case for some monster mudder rubbers, but I respecfully disagree on this point and submit that you will be fine with a 4.5" Edge lift for all terrain type 35's as demonstrated by my own appplication.
Then there's the U or V code spring option to get a couple of inches of lift in the front. If you want your Excursion to ride like an F250 or F350 then go for it. Look for the spring chart in this forum and note the travel and rates on the heavier factory springs. Your Excursion rides nice because of the C code springs with 5 inches of travel. Problem is that you don't get that in stock set up because they lowered the truck in the front for mass market appeal and the springs can't articulate without hitting the bump stops. Give them room to work and they work great, especially when you dampen them with single or dual bilsteins.
IMHO - big lifts equal crappy ride. Moderate lift with soft springs and good shocks equal good ride. I fell for all the BS ads from lift companies - you know - " designed with ride in mind", "softride", " 10 thin leafs for a better ride ", etc.. It's all BS. They use so many leaves so they can use cheap steel to get the lift and none of them ride worth a crap. It's an illusion. The stell in the two leaves in your C code X springs cost five times what the steel in those big 10 leaf packs do.
You have to decide for yourself. Do you want a show truck or something you can drive every day and travel in comfortably? Have you noticed that you never see monster trucks doing 12 hour drives?
Comments on blocks in the rear. The truck will be leveled depending on what size blocks you use in the rear to compensate for the lift in the front. The advantage to leaving the rear slightly lower than the front is to prevent driveshaft problems. The Edge 4.5" kit comes with a single 5" rear block to replace the rear factory 2" block which results in a net 3" lift in rear. Just ask for a 6" block if you want an exactly level truck. Also the block thing isa not really an issue until you start using really big blocks and these will cause problems for axle wrap and serious off roading.
Front box kits - a 3" kit doesn't need a front box kit or pitman arm on an Excursion because you really only bet about 2 inches of lift in the front because of the negative spring arch.
That's it for now.
2000 XLT Premium, V10, 4.3 LSD Rear, Edge 4.5" Hanger Lift, Landyot Radius Rods, Hellwig Sway Bar, Dual Bilsteins, 295 75 16 Nitto AT's, Billet Grill, Lengthened and Balanced Driveshaft, Hella 450's, Insulated AC Lines, Modified ZooDad, Husky Liners F to B.
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Everett Grabeel
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• Hollister, CA, USA |
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• Registered on 2/7/2003 |
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• 11 posts |
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Posted:9/7/2003 22:16 |
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Hey, back again, I will attest to being able to run 35" tires with only a 4" lift. I've done this on my super duty. Used EAGLE 589 RIMS AND 35" BFG tko ALLTERAINS. Here is the hang up with running 35" tires on only 4" lift. I used 16x10 weld wheels on my X and four wheel patrs accidently installed 4" springs instead of the 6" springs I had asked for The off set of these rims did cause the tires to rub on the plastic below the bumper. I gaurentee your tires will rub If your rims are the same offset as the welds that I bought, the eagles won't. The rims on my X stick out slightly more on the sides than my super duty. If your gonna buy off the shelf springs the skyjacker 6" softride are great and using the rs9000 shocks will stiffen it up if you want it a little tighter. I wont buy procomp springs again as they will make your rig ride like a roller skate. Just my experience, Good Luck. How blocks contribute to axle wrap is simple. The further the axle is from the spring pack,the more it acts like a lever causing the S shaped wrap. Makes for a nice rear end chatter when spinning the rears. I also had to reshim the rear axle on my X to get the drive line at the correct angle to get rid of highway viration, took care of it after reshimming once. Good Luck....Everett |
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Phil Eaton
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• Lander, WY, USA |
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• Registered on 4/28/2003 |
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• 42 posts |
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Posted:9/8/2003 11:09 |
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Nice thread packed with good info. Part of the consideration on the lift relative to tire size is contained in the thread including wheel width, offset and overall tire size. A wider tire will need more clearance when turning within the wheel well as a wider tire uses a larger arc when steering. Also, tires with identical size codes may have a different diameter in the final measurement from manufactuer to manufacturer.
Also, I previously read a post suggesting cutting one inch off the bump stop. I did so with good results on all 4 corners. I used the x code springs to raise the front of my x and then custom valved some bilsteins to reduce the compression and therefore impact harshness with the higher spring rate. Had I known, I would have kept the stock springs and gone with the Edge lift instead. I would imagine the result compared to my x is simular and I am happy with mine, but I took some risks by expermenting with the shock valving that would have been expensive to revalve and fine tune. The Edge lift is already sorted out and apparently popular with the pre-runner set stocking pits for off-road races. They need to haul cargo over pretty rough terain. |
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